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The trigger is Springfields flat trigger, first introduced on the Saint Victor line. I would deploy this as a dedicated entry rifle in a heartbeat. During our action test, we simply ignored the sights and read the dot. Any ways I just bought the Springfield Saint Victor in .308 . I realize in the current climate you may have to take what you can get. At the rear of the receiver, youll see the Maxim Defense SCW brace. They are meant to be easier to use and harder-hitting than a handgun but smaller and lighter than a rifle. Caliber + 300 BLK; 5.56 NATO; 7.62x39 . I was really happy . Before we jump headlong into what the market holds, perhaps we should touch upon why you might want to go a 300 Blackout pistol. Some big news for trigger pullers recently from the Civilian Marksmanship Program. Also visible with the top end hinged away was the Accu-Tite tension system consisting of a synthetic non-marring screw that mated flush beneath the bottom of the connecting lug. Learn how your comment data is processed. .300 BLK vs 7.62x39mm Designed for rapid deployment from concealment, the MCX Rattler packs a punch in the .300 BLK configuration. Has anyone actually tried the omega 9k on the rattler? He is a gun owner and avid reloader from Colorado. I installed it on an AR carbine but ended up taking it off, because while it felt good in my hand, it just didnt look right to my eye. PDWs are an established, in-between class of firearm. Springfield Armory SAINT 5.56 NATO [MSRP $919] - Bravo Company Buttstock/Pistol Grip/Handguard/Trigger Guard, Nickel Boron GI Trigger, 16 Melonite Barrel w/ 1:8 Twist. The handguard is crap, but I replaced mine with one I found here on the EE. We applied a snap-on buttpad from Limbsaver and was pleasantly surprised at how much more comfortable it was to shoot. To find out what it was like to operate these guns at speed, we visited the Impact Zone Range in Hempstead, Texas for some timed close-quarters fire. Over ten trigger pulls we never got the same reading twice. I run the SIG SRD762TI on my Rattler. Maybe they will give me some clarity. Visually, this made them less obvious. Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! For more information on the SIG MCX Rattler, please visit SigSauer.com. AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own. The new RIA 5.0 Sporting Pistol from Rock Island Armory features a patented RVS Recoil system that maximizes barrel mass and linear movement to give shooters super soft recoil. The buttstock was properly applied and showed only the slightest wiggle. Though, the pistol is a 1:8 twist rate affair. This is a 100-yard rifle. Our days at the range were somewhat windy, so waiting for a lull before releasing a shot was standard procedure. I had several concerns due to its comically short barrel, its accuracy, reliability and velocity. Reptilia sent me one of these compact grips late last year. They are more compact and lighter than ever, Making it the ideal weapon for Rapid deployment and close quarter work. Camp Guns: Sometimes Perfect, Other Times Not But Often Essential! If you need a discreet weapon for 100-yard engagements, its perfect. Sig offers several variants, including pistols with stabilizing braces. Eight major concealed carry insurance programs are now available to the millions of Americans who carry concealed. Yes, we would have preferred a flat-top gas block with rail for attaching a folding front sight, and were not exactly sure how to connect a sling to the front end without pulling on the barrel, but were not sure there is much else wrong. Ruger's multi-role small frame autoloading rifle - Sear - combines AR-10 power with AR-15 Portability. No problems except for the gas blowback. (Tie) B&T .45 2. Would I want to get shot with it at 200 yards? To test the SIG MCX Rattler SBR as it might be used on a deployment, I added a few accessories. For a firearm chambered in a rifle caliber, that is shockingly short, especially when you consider the first 2.26 inches or so is the chamber. The SIG MCX Rattler is an incredibly handy rifle thats easy to conceal. Units specializing in covert, ship-borne or hostage-rescue operations still wanted PDWs with more powerrifle-caliber power to be exact. The top rail was not really functional as a connection point, but it provided venting. We also tested with 77-grain OTM 223 Remington rounds manufactured by SIG Sauer. Maximum bullet weight was considered to be 69 grains. The only upgrade we spied was a relief in the takedown pin that helps keep the punch, or bullet tip, from sliding off under pressure. Comfortable to hold, the handguard offered the most versatility of our three rifles. JavaScript is disabled. Using the Lehigh Defense ammunition, its a 50-yard rifle. American Shooting Centers is a public range, and placing the rifle in the racks during cease fires with the bolt locked open required care because any impact to the buttstock would release the bolt. Thus, stabilizing subsonic ammo not an issue. But like you, I also bought the SA Saint Victor 300 BLK pistol, which is very well made. I actually sold my Sig m400 patrol 5.56 , And My Sig P320 . Got to check one out a few days ago at my LGS who's a Tier 1 Sig dealer. Garmin Tactix 7 Pro Ballistic Solar-Powered GPS Smartwatch: First Look, How to Choose the Best Scope Reticle for Your Application, Colt King Cobra Target 22LR Rimfire Revolver: New for 2022, Self-Defense Handgun and Ammo Options for People With Dexterity and Strength Issues, 5 Best Red-Dot Optics for SIG Sauer P365X & XL Pistols. However, the range in resistance spanned from about 6.75 pounds to almost 8.0 pounds. Of course, given the Rattlers short barrel, some gel testing was in order. Ah, the AR-pistol. Save my name and email to use for future comments. If the Mk4T had either of the triggers found on the SIG Sauer or Springfield Armory carbines, it might have been the accuracy champ of this test. Another design goal was optimized sound suppressor use, so sub- and supersonic 300 Blackout loads were developed. With the brace collapsed, it is just 18.75 inches long. The only mistake Springfield made on an otherwise terrific design, was to have the hand guard ride over the threads. Sounds like an excuse to get another can like a Dead Air Sandman-S. +1 this is what I ordered for my Rattler. Not only did the 77-grainers shoot straight, this uber-short-barreled pistol grouped between 2.5 and 4 MOA with everything I gave it. One answer would be to take advantage of the latest technology in terms of manufacturing, helpful features and improved ammunition. Barrel-twist rate was 1:8. Caleb Giddings, Marketing Manager at Taurus, introduces the all-new TaurusTX 22 Compact. What sets the SIG MCX Rattler apart? Anything beyond 100 yards and that starts to fade. We think this made the trigger a little more user friendly in that there seemed to be more time for the shooter to completely refine a shot. Suppressed though, that Saint Pistol is terrific. The Black Hills 77-grain OTM was best, producing 0.8-inch-wide groups, and the SIG Sauer 77-grain OTM ammunition produced an average five-shot group measuring 0.9 inch across. Wow just read the article on TTAG. I really appreciate the input. As a result of this solicitation, SIG Sauer designed the MCX Rattler, and Maxim Defense came out with the PDX. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. Essentially, this makes the suppressors job easier, since it has less expanding gas to dissipate. Springfield incorporates some nice accessories from Reptilia Corp. like the CQG pistol grip, which has a more vertical angle than the standard AR grip. So had to go home and think about it , while driving she asked which one I liked , i like them all but of course . Saw that email pop up today. I love my Evo .. You must log in or register to reply here. Support gear used:***Splatterburst Targetshttps://amzn.to/2Kera7g***Peltor Sport RangeGuard Hearing Protectionhttps://amzn.to/2LsLUbXThe Springfield XDM Elit. The detent spring was quite heavy and the grip necessary to compress it proved awkward. Wilson Combat SFX9 5-Inch Solid Frame 9mm Pistol: First Look. I took the Saint victor home and that's all it wrote for me . Between the friendly trigger, which our shooter was able to stage as we moved from target to target, and some adrenalin, we had added one full circuit, even if all 15 shots werent perfect. And After shooting the CZ 75 Tatical sport orange I was in love . I usually have to take break between mags. I'm looking for advice on whether to buy a Sig Sauer MCX or the Springfield Armory Saint (new free float version). This round was designed to offer terminal ballistics similar to the AKs 7.62x39mm while still being compatible with AR-style rifles, requiring only a barrel change. This removed any slack between the upper and lower ends of the rifle. (Tie) LWRC Smg-45 ($3k?fuck!) It was too short. So, I spread the wealth equally. As for Springfields PDW, it is an AR, so it has familiar controls. Instead of being located at 3 oclock and 9 oclock, additional Keymod holes were located in a line upon the surface area that angled upward to the top rail (10 oclock and 2 oclock). In these times, what you want and what is available are two very different things. The first was the SilencerCo Omega 9K, which is only 4.7 inches long and weighs 7.2 ounces. With the brace fully extended, the pistol is 23.5-inches in length. The target to our right showed three A-zone hits and a stray shot in the D-zone, furthest from center. 2023 Outdoor Sportsman Group. Do Pistols Benefit From Popular Aftermarket Modifications? As our tests continued and the trigger broke in, we sometimes experienced only one stopping point before break. The pistol is supplied with flip-up front and rear sights that sit relatively tall when folded and dont take up much rail space. MSRP: $2,000; wilsoncombat.com. (Notice they fixed this on the new Edge pistol with a longer barrel.) .224 Valkyrie Small Precision Rifle Cartridge: Everything You Need to Know, Buyer Beware: Buying 'Bargain' Guns Can Be Risky. For example, Ive seen U.S. Department of State Diplomatic Security Service special agents wielding them in the field when guarding high-value targets. Decibels dont drop like flies with every load. Though its important to enter this aspect of the cartridge with eyes wide open. Matte Black. We liked this because it simply wipes clean, making it easy to keep track of debris buildup and wear. Now we've got Springfield's PDW in a similarly sized envelope, namely albeit chambered in 5.56 NATO. You are using an out of date browser. The only difference are the built in QD mounts to any other lower. The visual theme of the Saint was that it looks to be one piece instead of an upper and lower, or as some say, it looks monolithic. However, the company Match Duo, with a 5.5 break, does a much better job of getting the most out of the pistol. But you may have noticed complete uppers selling for as little as $400 during the last rounds of holiday sales and complete carbines selling for less than $700. But there are a few key reasons why the .30-caliber is better suited for compact ARs. The Sig Enhanced is heavy and not as responsive as youd expect in a gun of this class, somewhat akin to a mil-spec job. However, I ended up loving it for what it is. Im a lefty so the gas hits me right in the face. The Sig Virtus has these possible configurations: 300 Blackout: Barrel Lengths 6.75", 9", and 16" 5.56mm : Barrel Lengths 11.5" and 16" The Virtus is the more flexible platform, but there is nothing wrong with the Rattler. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Whereas there is nothing special about the front sight, buttstock, or handguard, upgrades to the magazine release, safety levers, and the bolt catch are more expensive to manufacture or supply than a fancy handguard or buttstock. The new 9mm suppressor can mount easily to any pistol barrel threaded x28 inches and doesn't compromise on sound suppression, gas blowback or recoil. Choice of ammunition for AR-15s used to be limited by the 1:9-inch-twist barrel. Handguards are now modular platforms for lights, lasers, and sights, and ambidextrous fire controls are becoming more popular as well. Probably, but not at 900 fps. In the confusion the shot was released off line or as one might say, out of time. 9mm this thing is a work of art and insanely smooth as silk , it shoots its self ..LOL. The base of the grip was hinged to expose a storage space that was water resistant, thanks to a rubber gasket. The Barnes 110-grain TAC-TX had fully expanded by 7 inches, leaving a perfectly mushroomed bullet weighing 108 grains at 26 inches. Our action test was designed to tell us more about trigger response and maneuverability than could be culled from a static benchrest session. The SCAR 15P is chambered for 5.56 NATO and, with its 7.5-inch barrel, is the most compact SCAR to date. But if you want range, get a longer-barreled rifle with a slower twist rate to optimize 125-grain loads. Rattler was built to be fired primarily unsuppressed, with the ability to be suppressed, if needed. Meet the all-new Taurus Judge Executive Grade, a revolver featuring a hand-polished satin finish, presentation-grade wood grips, a brass rod front sight and an exceptional hand-tuned trigger. One of the ways that we suspect the suggested retail price of the Saint was held down was by utilizing an A1 front-sight assembly. Pushing the SIG Sauer 77-grain OTM rounds to an average velocity of 2440 fps, the SIG Sauer ammunition, marked Match Grade Rifle, was still nevertheless well below the 2750 fps printed on the box. Facing off in a handgun challenge featuring the smallest professional-grade enclosed red dot sight on the market, Eric and Tom put the Acro P-2 to the distance test by doing a walk-back challenge. Please give me your thoughts and opinions! For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Modern PDWs are often designed to be able to penetrate soft body armor with armor-piercing (AP) ammo. It's a little longer but CZ Bren 2 MS pistol can be had in 5.56 or 7.62x39 with a couple added inches of barrel than the Sig Rattler. Featuring a 5.5" PDW barrel, the MCX platform has never been more compact or accessible. Its truly impressive. Targets left and center showed four A-zone hits, but one shot on each target was outside of the A-zone. Sorry for long story .Your CZ Bren are pretty cool looking guns , I got the CZ Evo3 in OD green with SB 3 tactical folding brace on it . Our Team Said: When it comes to paying more for a rifle, or any firearm for that matter, its easy to check off a list of features to justify a higher price tag. Let's pick up there. Despite the unique internals, the MCXs controls are similar to a standard ARs, which helps because most shooters are familiar with the latters manual of arms. There was another location for a QD sling from either side at the rear of the receiver just below where the buffer tube was attached. Colt Model 1861 Special Musket: What's Its Value? The Springfield Saint AR-15 is a great entry-level AR-15 that is easy to use and customize. Thanks to the precise trigger, the shooter always felt he was in complete control. Given the paperwork and money you spent on the can, is it worth testing twist-rates theories yourself? It has a nickel boron coating and provides a single-stage trigger pull. On the M400, there is an extension that adds surface area in an L-shape, making it much easier to operate. they bring all the guns and you buy the ammo and have a blast . Sig's new SnakeBite . As to the brace, its a Tailhook Mod 2, an adjustable model that does an excellent job of settling in the gun. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. To change the shooters perspective and in effect reduce target area, we staggered the targets. The full-profile barrel creates a line that grows from a polymer handguard by Bravo Company that was flat on the sides, adorned with sections of pebbled finish for grip. I assumed shooting this gun would be like holding a concussion grenade in my teeth, but I was pleasantly surprised thanks to the Hate Brake. It's The only Sig I have left I won't give up because I like it that much . Bought separately, the SCW (with this H3 buffer) retails for $590. Sig 716i or Springfield Victor Saint .308. To test this, I fed the PDW Black Hills 77-grain TMK load in addition to more traditional offerings. The Sig Rattler would fit the description of what your looking for perfectly with a 5.5 in .300blk barrel and no buffer tube. You got the CZ shadow 2 orange is it 9mm or 40 cal. It also directs sound and blast forward, away from the shooter and provides some flash reduction. The gas block is pinned in place. This is the MCX Rattler. But in spite of all that, I find myself wanting one, a lot. Built with a premium nickel boron coated trigger, forged carrier, enhanced Melonite coated carrier group and a pinned gas block, every rifle is built for ultimate reliability. SIG Sauer MCX-SPEAR: Civilian Version of XM7 Rifle Arrives! Forged rather than cast aluminum is now the standard, and machining is more exact thanks to computer numerically controlled (CNC) automation. You have entered an incorrect email address! I just wish the right-side lever was shorter so it wouldnt bump my trigger finger when flipping it off. The M-Lok handguard gives you the ability to attach . We tend to the 7.5-inch SBA3 model, given its the rare smallster in the caliber that doesnt demand a kings ransom. In the same breath, the gun is compact enough to enhance its nimbleness, yet big enough to ensure the cartridges ballistic integrity. The ambidextrous controls worked quite well, and the safety lever on the off hand did not interfere with the shooter, be he right-handed or left-handed. I mainly shoot at an indoor range. Now weve got Springfields PDW in a similarly sized envelope, namely albeit chambered in 5.56 NATO. As far as stabilization, it features the fairly standard SB Tactical SBA3 brace. Here are my personal Pros & Cons of the Saint Victor (FEATURELESS, CA Compliant version) Pros: - Comes with basic flip-up sights ready to go out of box - Full length M-Lok rail slots (TREAD seems to stop 8/10 of the way from the front) - Lighter Cons: - $1400+tax - 2 port MB rather than M400's 3 port (any difference in felt recoil?) I Have the 1st Sig's M400 Tread and it's a nice gun , It shoots great and built very good . Joe Kurtenbach and Caleb Giddings also look at the first-ever optics-ready carry revolvers with the new Taurus 605 and 856 T.O.R.O. The Judge has been promoted! Taylors & Company FS Tactical 1911: Now in 10mm! I plan on using it primarily for hunting and some plinking. The rear-sight assembly (sometimes referred to as BUIS or backup iron sight) was a flip-up design. MSRP: $1,100; springfield-armory.com. Neither rifle is "top tier," so to speak. The Springfield Armory Saint Edge PDW brings to mind a saying from Rush Limbaugh: Illustrating absurdity by being absurd. It offers, at least when compared to a standard rifle/carbine, compromised ballistics and a nearly comical appearance, and I havent done executive protection work in quite some time. Many contend a 1:8 twist will stabilize heavy subsonic bullets. Thanks Bio. The $1000 CMMG Mk4T may still use the M1 buttstock and grip, but the 416 stainless-steel barrel offered a 1:7 twist on the inside and a bead-blast finish on the outside. Target-left was placed 5 yards downrange, target-right 7 yards downrange, and the center target 10 yards downrange. If I did buy another SIG rifle it would be the 716 to replace my Victor .308 (most know my issues with this gun). Life has a melody. Because I knew the velocity would be lacking, most of my chronographing was done with 5.56 NATO ammo, which runs a bit hotter. Since then, the company expanded the line of guns to include a range of variations that fall into three main lines. Springfield currently doesnt have any plans for a version in .300 AAC Blackout, but (hint hint) it would be a very smart move, as the .300 BLK performs much better out of short barrels than the 5.56. To extend it, just give the brace a vigorous yank. In late 2019, Springfield released the SAINT Pistol, featuring upgraded components and a retail price of just $849. He called it a stutter. Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. After comparing the two the Springfield was built better and . The first and third pics are the rifle I examined, but the second isn't. Even though the Victor has a 9-inch barrel (1:7 twist), the last feature is a nice piece of mind. There was a slot for threading a sling and also a hole on each side for attaching a QD sling loop. At that time the price on that gun was $1,800. Type: Semi-Auto Pistol. I've shot the Saint a few times and my local lgs and I like the trigger, feel and ergonomics. Caliber: 300 AAC Blackout-MSRP: 1015. With the specs they listed, the barrel couldnt be much more than 6 inches, and it had to havethe ability to swap between the specd .300 BLK top end and one chambered in 5.56. New! With regard to accuracy, I wasnt just worried that a 5.5-inch barrel, which sports just 3.25-inches of rifling, would shoot minute of bucket, I was worried there wouldnt be enough spin to stabilize heavy bullets out to 100 yards. The Rattler has a one in five twist rate. I suppose this is due, in part, to how much gas is escaping out the short barrel past the bullet instead of gathering force behind it as it would in a longer barrel. The issue is, get it wrong, send a bullet yawling at the muzzle and youre contending with endcap and baffle strikes in your suppressor. It loves 150 grain bullets, does well down to 120 grain below that that deer,hog killer doesnt group to my expectations. We also liked the bead-blast finish on the barrel.